WDS 64: Discussion on 'Premature-ejaculation' by Prof. Ramakant Sharma 'Chulet', Dr. D. C. Katoch, Dr. Raghuram Bhatta, Dr. Pawan Madaan, Dr. Ashwini Kumar Sood, Dr. Ankur Sharma, Dr. Janardan Hebber, Dr. Mayur Surana, Dr. Shashi Jindal, Dr. V. B. Pandey, Dr. Bhavesh Modh, Dr. Shekhar Singh Rathod, Dr. Rajaneesh Pathak & Others.

[12/13, 14:34] Dr Ankur Sharma, Delhi:

Premature ejaculations \involuntary nocturnal seminal discharge  are  natural phenomenon, not a pathological.

These type of practice only degrade esteem of ayurvedic drs.

How shall one decide

Pre mature ejaculations & treatment response ?? only on basis of history.

[12/13, 14:50] Vd V. B. Pandey Basti U. P: 

Though it's not possible neither wise but it's great belief in patients mind even in learned persons that Ay.med. are best for premature ejaculation.

[12/13, 15:04] Dr Rajanish Pathak:

 Ab Dr Ankur ji private college me patient ayega... Usko ap jo bheje hai yahi keh kar lauta nahi skte.... Now he is ok n feeling much better than before,  he said laziness n weakness improved also.

Hunger also improved

He has also much relief,  but I have to improve his sperm count,  he has no child.

They have much believe in Ayurveda too....

[12/13, 17:35] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

Dr. Ankur please go through, many couples have low fertility index due to this type of problems, but most of them donot know even, recently I am treating a couple for primery infertility. Female was diagnosed  with hypothyroidism, anovulatory cycles, was irritable. She treated for hypothyroidism and ovulation was induced. even then she did not conceived. Semen analysis was normal, male partner was physically fit. Lately on last visit it was found as a case of premature ejaculation.

[12/13, 17:49] Dr Ankur Sharma, Delhi: 

Premature ejaculations is only due to fear, anxiety nervousness,

Nothing else.

These are Maanshik bhaav....

Can be cured with proper counseling.

[12/13, 17:50] Dr Priy-ranjan Tiwari, Haridwar: ☑☑👌

[12/13, 17:52] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

Neurotransmitters play a major role.

[12/13, 18:00] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

Sir in India we do not have very good counselors who can treat anxiety fear nervousness etc. only with counseling.

[12/13, 18:04] Janardan Hebbar Dr:

In most cases of PE that I have treated successfully, mere counseling does not help much.

A person with anxious mind turns deaf ears to comforting words. 🤷🏼‍♂

[12/13, 18:23] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 

PE causing infertility ??

[12/13, 18:26] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

it may be hypothetical but female partners may get so disturbed that they don't n conceive, or conceive late.

[12/13, 18:27] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 

Along with Counseling, Placebo is also essential. 😉

[12/13, 18:29] Dr Ankur Sharma, Delhi: 

YEs  i agree with u on this statement

Dr shab👍😁

[12/13, 18:46] Vd V. B. Pandey Basti U. P: 

Ashwgandha in any form is one of the best med.for PE.

[12/13, 19:03] Deepak Bassi Dr: 

Kindly guide about managment🙏🏿

[12/13, 19:10] Janardan Hebbar Dr:

 Vatahara therapies.

Shilapravavnga

Tentex forte

Bhringarajasava

Ashwagandharishta

Ksheerabala taila capsule

Kegels exercise

Genital massage with ksheerabala / balashwagandhadhi

Raisins, saffron dates.

Being naked on bed or wearing loose cloth despite not having sex ( decreases sensitivity)

Decrease in sex frequency, if they are trying daily.

[12/13, 19:10] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 

What type of placebo pl explain...

[12/13, 19:10] Dr Ashwini Kumar Sood, Ambala: 

PE it's mind game. Counselling exercise diet all are important. Drugs are important too. Overeating, lack of exercise, big belly pts should not expect any benefit from treatment. All that herbs good for muscular strength are good for PE too. Withania is time tested effective for it .

[12/13, 19:10] Dr Ashwini Kumar Sood, Ambala: 

Add anti depressive drugs along with like withania.

[12/13, 19:11] Dr Rameshwar Rao Rane: 

is there any reference in ayu text about pe ??

[12/13, 19:18] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 👍🏻

[12/13, 19:19] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 

Anything sir. If pt. trust you, sugar candy can work.

[12/13, 19:20] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh:

 good , very nice article 🙏🏼is she member of this gp. ?

[12/13, 19:28] Vd V. B. Pandey Basti U. P: 

It's useless consoling  patient of PE infact it's better to told him about mis use of various drugs mainly a type of narcotics atleast he would be benefited from being chested.

[12/13, 19:30] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 

Better to use medhy rasayan.

[12/13, 19:31] Hardik Chandra Kalal Vd: 👌🏻👌🏻🙏🏻

[12/13, 19:32] Deepak Bassi Dr: ThNkyou🙏🏿

[12/13, 19:35] Janardan Hebbar Dr: 

Chyawanprash

Mahakalyanaka ghrita

Vigomax forte

[12/13, 19:37] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 

Off course sir.

Ashwagandha is drug of choice.

One Non ayurvedic person claimed, As ashwagandha is better than Chinease Ginseng.

[12/13, 19:41] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 

एक्स ग्रुप मेम्बर, स्वर्गीय डॉ राजकुमार अनवानी, नागपुर, इस हेतु स्वनिर्मित सिध्द मकरध्वज का पान/मलाई में एक वर्ष प्रयोग कराते थे।

उनके अनुसार एक बार एक वर्ष लेने पर इसका रसायन प्रभाव कई वर्ष तक रहता है ।

[12/13, 19:45] Vd V. B. Pandey Basti U. P: 

एक वर्ष तो बहुत जयादा है सिद्ध मकरध्वज एक माह के लिए भी काफी है परंतु रोगी की अवस्था चालीस के अधिक नहीं होनी चाहिए ।

[12/13, 19:46] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

amla is sheet veerya  and shunthi amla gur are madhur vipak drugs in hreetkyadi rsayan.

[12/13, 19:46] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 

Cap. JUVIN 2 bd with milk

It contains:

1-Pusp Dhanva Ras

2-manmathabhr RAS

3- prawal posting etc.

One more important thing is kaunch pak and madananand modak very important.

Kaunch pak has opium ,shows extra ordinary results . One of my Muslim Pt of 22 yrs age informed that -बीबी अपनी माँ के पास चली गई यह कहकर कि इसी उम्र में मर्दानगी कम है तो आगे क्या होगा ।ससुराल वाले कहते हैं कि तुम्हारी बीबी राज़ी हो तो ले जाओ!!

In such cases Mal nutrition/ras kshay is main cause of shukra kshaya resulting in harshan abhav. I prescribed aswagandha and kaunch pak with ahiphen. After 3 weeks he visited sasural and came with wife .

Maximum formulation of kaunch pak are having opium as an ingredient but no one manufacturing as original.

Madananad modal is very simple formulation for this purpose. One can include it as a part of diet.

[12/13, 19:49] Vd V. B. Pandey Basti U. P: 

Don't know about Madananad modal .

[12/13, 19:50] Mayur Surana Dr: 

That is for srushtapureeshtva without causing balhani...also yavanna is advised after sansarjan kram which is also sheet and intended for gamitwa towards pureesh--puraan mala shodhan.

[12/13, 19:51] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 

मदनानंद मोदक

[12/13, 19:53] Vd V. B. Pandey Basti U. P: 

Really I had heard about it but I think it's भांग ।

[12/13, 19:59] Dr Yogesh Gupta: 

🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻 SIR ANY SPECIFIC INGREDIENTS, IF YOU KNOW, THEY USED TO ADD IN THE SAME. ...

[12/13, 20:00] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 

मकरध्वज स्वर्ण सहित it self is sufficient.

[12/13, 20:00] Dr Yogesh Gupta:

 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻 WHY NOT TO USE ABOVE THE AGE OF 40 YRS.

[12/13, 20:01] Dr Yogesh Gupta: 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🌹🌹🌹

[12/13, 20:14] Dr Pravin Soni Beawar: 

Manmath ras

Sukrmatrika vati

Nripativallbh ras

Chandroday vises

Veeryshodhan churan

Labub kabir

Majun ispndsokthini

Abhyamrita rasayn

[12/13, 20:15] Deepak Bassi Dr: 

Habee mumsik is also good...

[12/13, 20:15] Dr Pravin Soni Beawar: 

Yes sir !

[12/13, 20:16] Dr Pravin Soni Beawar: 

Also majun mughlaij jawahr wali...

Unani medcn has good result in ed & pe....

[12/13, 20:17] Deepak Bassi Dr: 

Yes sir

Habbe nishat👌🏿

[12/13, 20:17] Deepak Bassi Dr: 

They have a lot of formulations....

[12/13, 20:17] Dr Pravin Soni Beawar: 👌🏻👌🏻

[12/13, 20:42] Dr Ashwini Kumar Sood, Ambala: 

It's important to listen to the pt what HE wants, on HER demand only add opium product because once you add opium unnecessarily than difficult to delete it. In no response add antidepressants, opium is last choice.

[12/13, 20:42] Prof. Deep Narayan Pandey: 

I am also claiming, based on the safety as well as effectiveness.

Ashwagandha could not complete to ginseng not because of it's therapeutic characteristics but because of the aggressive marketing by China.

[12/13, 20:43] Dr Narinder Pal, Jammu: 

pe can be correlated with shukrgata vata..so shukrbalya medicines works well and have long term benefit instead of shukrstambhak medicines like ahiphen etc..also we have to work on rasa dhatu as well whole mental and physcial health of the patient.

again apan vayu plays a major role..u will get apana vayu dushti in most of the cases..constipation is one of them..sukumaram ghritam works excellent here..

[12/13, 20:45] Dr Ashwini Kumar Sood, Ambala: 👌👌

[12/13, 20:54] Dr Ashwini Kumar Sood, Ambala: JUVIN👌👌

[12/13, 20:54] Dr Ankur Sharma, Delhi: 

Depression

Lack of love and faith between partners is important factor

According to charak samihita

"Desirable lady is best vaazikarak."

If female has bitter tongue, quarrelsome, unhygienic then no tonic \vaazikarak will be helpful.

[12/13, 20:56] Dr Ashwini Kumar Sood, Ambala: 

Depression will mean here that if previous performance is not their pt loses confidence and its major factor.

[12/13, 20:56] Dr Darshan Parmar MO Guj: ✅

[12/13, 21:01] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 

Sir it is result oriented not having bhang ahifen etc.

[12/13, 21:45] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 

As Per my information, most of the drugs, based on Shashtreeya formulae, are made without Ahifen now a days.

Only Kaminy vidravan ras - Nagarjun contains Ahifen.

[12/13, 21:46] Vd V. B. Pandey Basti U. P: 

Sir tomorrow I will put my point regarding use of makaradhvaj below 40.

[12/13, 21:48] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 

I advised one of my friends, for mild to moderate ED+PE Tentex Royal 2 BD.

Responded positive. Don't know, drug effect or Pacibo 😁

[12/13, 22:05] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 

It is known drug , you can’t say it placebo sir !!

[12/13, 22:10] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 🙏🏻

[12/13, 22:12] Dr. D C Katoch sir: 

Has anyone in the group tried Trivang Bhasm or Bangeshwar Ras in PE cases ?

[12/13, 22:17] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 

कभी कभी कोई थपकी दे देता है -कि

चढ़ जा बेटे सूली पर भली करेंगे राम,

और जोश आ जाता है तो ही भला हो जाता है,

यह वस्तुत: कुछ अजीब सी परिस्थिति है,

PE का निर्णय कर्ता नहीं करता, प्रतिद्वन्द्वी करता है जो सामान्य परिस्थितियों में कभी भी ME घोषित नहीं करता 🙏🙏

[12/13, 22:20] Anju Navle Dr. Puna: 

Just day before yesterday I have given to a patient, he will give feedback in few days.

[12/13, 22:21] Anju Navle Dr. Puna: 

Trivanga bhasma...

[12/13, 22:21] Prof. D. S. Mishra Sir: 

PE में त्रिवंग भस्म बृहद बंगेश्वर रस एवं विजया के योग कामदेव मोदक，मदनानन्द मोदक प्रभावी हैं !

[12/13, 22:22] Anju Navle Dr. Puna: 

For how long we should give it as treatment....

[12/13, 22:25] Prof. D. S. Mishra Sir: 

वंगं भक्षयतो नरस्य न भवेत् स्वप्नेपि न भवेत् शुक्रक्षय.....

[12/13, 22:36] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 

१-वंगं भक्षयतो नरस्य न भवेत् स्वप्नेपि न भवेत् शुक्रक्षय (“बंग भक्षण करने वाले व्यक्ति के स्वप्न में भी शुक्रक्षय नहीं होता “)

२-स्वपनेपि वंगं भक्षयतो नरस्य स्वप्नेपि  शुक्रक्षय न भवेत् (स्वप्न में भी जो बंग भक्षण करता है उसे स्वप्न में भी शुक्रक्षय नहीं होता )

३-वंगं भक्षयतो नरस्य न भवेत् स्वप्नेपि शुक्रक्षय (अर्थात् स्वप्न में भी निरन्तर प्रवृत्ति होती रहती है कभी क्षय नहीं होता ??अति प्रवृत्ति??

४-वंगं भक्षयतो नरस्य न भवेत् स्वप्नेपि शुक्रक्षय—-जागृतावस्थायान्तु भवत्येव !!!

इसका सही अर्थ समझ में ही नहीं आता !!!

कैसे तो अन्वय होगा श्लोक का और

क्या परिणाम होगा भक्षण का

तथा कब होगा !!!

[12/13, 22:42] Dr Ashwini Kumar Sood, Ambala: 

Group members have rich experience dealing with PE AND ED..

[12/13, 22:43] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 

😆😆😆😆😆😆

इसमें बहुत चक्कर है l

[12/13, 22:47] Dr Ashwini Kumar Sood, Ambala: 

रोगी को चक्कर से बाहर निकल ना ही हमारा काम है l

[12/13, 22:47] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 

PE के मरीज पोर्न के कारण बढ़ गए हैं, पिछले कुछ सालों में।।

[12/13, 22:50] Dr. Venkat Joshi UK: 

Paraphiliac tendencies have much dysfunctional

More than 40 type known and many unknown

In Delhi there was a client in 1985 7th world congress of sexuality

He had gold, silver and other metal based canes compulsive to hit on bum for erecting

Dr Prakash kothari from Mumbai organised conference

Self help!

Because psycho-neuroendocrine , CNS, Sympathetic and parasympathetic, neurotransmitter based variations in complexity

 Of sexual inadequacy and dysfunction

Some of them obsessed with semen plaques creating by smeared and freezing to use orally.

[12/13, 22:59] Dr. Venkat Joshi UK: 

When I argued we don’t have such crazy people in India....bounced back with evidences shown during conference.

[12/13, 23:09] Dr Ashwini Kumar Sood, Ambala: 

Such psychopaths have increased in number presently no doubt but For of them antipsychotic treatment is first line

 With novel antipsychotic group of drugs it's very easy to treat even on Opd basis dr Venkat.

[12/13, 23:21] Dr. Venkat Joshi UK: Okay 👌

[12/13, 23:34] Dr Rameshwar Rao Rane: 

yes i gave vang bhasma to two pts for nightfall but i didnt get desired results. what is the real meaning of this stanza ??

[12/14, 03:33] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir:

Increased timing of intercourse showing stambhan gun.

[12/14, 05:27] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh:

 sir I use bangshil and fortege.

[12/14, 06:29] Dr Yogesh Gupta: 

🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻 MAM I ALSO USE THE SAME AND ALWAYS GIVE GOOD RESULTS.

[12/14, 08:11] pawan madan Dr: 

🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

Kaunch paak.....found more better in improving the quality of semen

Madnanand modak...👍🏻

But on the whole when a person thinks fear he is not able to perform.

One interesting finding is the use of

...prabhakar vati

And

...hridyarnava rasa for ED and PE.

These does Raktavaha srotoshodhan, improve the quality of raktavah srotas in the genital area thus showing results.

Draksharisht is another thin when given in high foses improves ED AND PE.

But still we need to counsel the person to change h8s thinking pattern. The Law of Attraction works here very much and we need to use this.

🙏🏻🙏🏻🌹🌹

[12/14, 08:13] pawan madan Dr: 🙏🏻🙏🏻

What are the other uses of Sidha Makardhwaj other than this?

I am planning to give this to my father 78 yrs...for general debility, he feels more cold.

Pls suggest...🙏🏻

[12/14, 08:13] pawan madan Dr: 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻✅

[12/14, 08:14] pawan madan Dr: 👌👌👌👌

Plus

...change of thinking.....

[12/14, 08:15] pawan madan Dr: ✅👍🏻

[12/14, 08:31] Janardan Hebbar Dr: 

Sirji, in most of the cases that I get, the matter is not about huge expectation it to have sex twice the same night.

The matter is more about ejaculating before oenetration or just with the thought of sex or as soon as they undress or  ejaculation within 10 seconds after penetration.

Each case is different. There are so many components to this disease.... From diabetes to marriage tensions to hypersensitive foreskin to hypersensitive mind.

[12/14, 08:32] Deepak Bassi Dr: 🙏🏿

[12/14, 08:35] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

Ch chi chapter 2-4, shukra kshya nidan and shukrapravriti describes so nicely.🙏🏼

[12/14, 09:20] Samta Tomar Dr Jmngr: 🙏🏽👍🏻

[12/14, 09:30] pawan madan Dr: 

True....agree 100%

[12/14, 09:40] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

it has also given the concept of emission and expultion.

[12/14, 09:53] Dr Bhavesh Modh: 

स्वप्नदोष, E.D. , P.E. के जो भी मरीज़  बने है उनके  पीछे उनही के " *मन के वांधे* "  जिम्मेदार होते है ।

चिकित्सक, उनको सही सही जानकारी  व्यहवारीक उदाहरण के साथ समजा  शके तो  मर्ज  से मुक्ति मिले ।

यथा... अविवाहित व्यक्ति स्वप्नदोष की शिकायत ले के आता है तो उसे .. म्युनिसिपल नल के साथ जोड़ा हुआ पानी के टंके का उदाहरण दे, नित्य पानी आयेगा पर इस्तमाल न होगा तो ऑवरफ्लो होना है,

बाद मे रेकटम व ब्लेडर के बीच मे  स्थित seminal vesicle डायाग्राम के जरीए दिखाए... अकसर मल से भरा रेकटम या मूत्र से भरा हुआ ब्लेडर का बेक प्रेशर निंद के दौरान,  व दिनभर मे आँखों से देखे व कानो से सुने जातीयता को उतेजन देने वाले द्दश्य श्राव्य माध्यमो की असर रात को अवचेतन मन पे होती है । उसकी वजह से स्वप्न दोष होता है ।

मन को शांत करने के लिए सुबह आल्प्रेक्ष 0.25  या  Sertraline 50 mg  टेबलेट  दी जा शकती है एक या दो सप्ताह...

युवा अभी मन बहलाने के लिए तमाकु के उत्पाद इस्तमाल करते है उसे तो यह मेडिसीन ज्यादा फायदेमंद है।

रात्रि मे मल मूत्र त्याग के बाद ही शयन करे व  *जातीफलचुर्ण + पीपरीमूलचुर्ण दुध के साथ ले ।*

 नये या एक साल के भीतर के, विवाहित व्यक्ति की समस्या PE की होती है ओर दवाए लेने आने पर बीवी का असंतोष का कारण धर देते है,  हालांकी औरत को इनके PE से कोइ शिकायत अकसर नही होती यदि समय पर संतानसुख मिल गया है तो...

एसे केसीस मे वात्सायनकृत कामसूत्र मे निर्देशीत फोरप्ले व आफटरप्ले का महत्व से एसे मरीज़ो को ज्ञात करना चाहिए ,

संभोग के पूर्व ग्लान्स पेनीस पे lignocaine gel 2%  अच्छी तरह लगा ले व कोन्डम का प्रयोग करे ... इस का एक दो सप्ताह प्रयोग करने से मरीज़ का आत्मविश्वास बढ जाता है । आखिर मन के वांधे ही बिमारी की जड होती है ।

कषायरस  प्रधान आहार व औषध  मांसपेशियों की शिथीलता  हटाते है ।

ED के मरीज़ अकसर 40 - 45 उम्र के बाद के होते है  मानसिक चिंताए  जिम्मेदार होता है ।

 माना जाता है,  की DM के मरीज को ED  परेशान करता है,  पर DM मे भी तो मानसीक परीताप एक प्रमुख कारण होता है ।

ED के मरीज़ मेच्योर्ड होते है । मन के व्यथाओ से परेशान हो के संभोग को स्लीपिंग पिल्स के विकल्प के तौर पे आजमाते  है, नतीज़ा ED

फिर OTC  sildenafil 50 या 100 मी.ग्रा. की खा के ही आते है , इसलिए tadalafil ( Todora or Tadicip) 20 mg दे,   हफ्ते मे चार से अधिक इस्तमाल ना करे, दो तीन हफ्ते   देने  से  आत्मविश्वास बढ आयेगा ।

भोजन मे प्याज - प्लांडु काफी फायदेमंद रहा है,

देशी जंगली कौंचा  जो एरंड बीज के समान चित्रित वर्ण के होते है, उसका पाउडर + सुंठी पाउडर  समानमात्रा मे एक से दो चम्मच सुबह मे व रात मे पीपरीमूलचुर्ण के साथ कौंचा पाउडर दुध के साथ एक माह पर्यंत देने से ED की समस्या विदा होती है

विवाहित जोड़े मे ED के मरीज़ की बीवी को भी काउन्सलींग करना चाहिए क्योंकि शास्त्र मे लिखा है की श्रेष्ठ वाजीकरण स्त्री है ।

[12/14, 10:07] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 👌🏻👌🏻

[12/14, 10:10] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

relation of bhaya  and hridya 👌👌👌👍🏼🙏🏼

[12/14, 10:12] Dr Rahul Pathania: 

Vang bhasm alone sometimes is not fully effective.so I added mahasudarshan ch. and found marvellous results in nocturnal emissions.

[12/14, 10:13] Dr Rahul Pathania:

 U can also add swarn makshik to enhance the effect.

[12/14, 10:15] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 

Krimi, is also causes NE many times.

[12/14, 10:16] Dr Rahul Pathania:

Yes mahasudarshan is krimihar too...

[12/14, 10:17] Gajanand Chatuphale Vdo:

For PE

Jatiphaladee Gutika

Vang bhasma

Shudha kupilu churna.

[12/14, 10:17] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

mahasudarshan ch is aam pachak..

[12/14, 10:18] Gajanand Chatuphale Vdo: 👍

[12/14, 10:18] Dr Rahul Pathania: 

Also add hingul bhasm.

[12/14, 10:19] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 

Jatifaladi ahifen yukt ??

[12/14, 10:20] Gajanand Chatuphale Vdo: 

No

Jatiphala

Ajmoda

And another 2-3 contents

One pharmacy from Madhya Pradesh..

[12/14, 10:20] Gajanand Chatuphale Vdo: 

No visha or upavisha is included..

[12/14, 10:21] Dr Rahul Pathania: 

In absence of ahifen,Parsik yawani is alternate.Any comments abt.its efficacy ???

[12/14, 10:22] Gajanand Chatuphale Vdo: 

ED OR PEis often related With vyan vayu vikruti hence drugs like Prabhakar vati/ Jaharmohara pishti acts nicely.

[12/14, 10:39] pawan madan Dr: 

Dr Rahul Ji

Whats your logic of using mahasudarshan in such cases ?

[12/14, 10:46] Dr Ankur Sharma, Delhi: 

Sir ji

Tikt ras pradhan aausdh decrease semen volume as per basic principles of ayurveda.

[12/14, 11:02] Dr Rajanish Pathak: 

Yeah, I counsel him for 1month brahmacharya & least use of mobile or any Device, spicy food, other stress or any mental illness I adviced him savashana.

[12/14, 11:03] Dr Rajanish Pathak: 👏🏻👏🏻😌

[12/14, 11:05] Dr Rajanish Pathak: 

I support Shekhar Sir....

[12/14, 11:08] Dr Rajanish Pathak: 

Charak chikitsa 30

me.....PE ya sukrakshya k treatment me Shodhan anivarya kiya h,

Sukrasodhan

Then sukravardhan....

[12/14, 11:09] Dr Rajanish Pathak: 

Mostly PE ya  secondary infertility me constipation mila hai...

Ya bas vatanuloman matra me hi bina specific drugs se ache results hain..

[12/14, 11:16] Dr Rajanish Pathak: 

Thanks to all...

Dr Rahul sir, Dr Shekhar sir, Dr. Gajanan Sir, Dr Ankur sir !

[12/14, 11:23] Dr Rahul Pathania: 

Mahasudarshan does veerya Shodhan and aampachan.

[12/14, 11:25] Gajanand Chatuphale Vdo: 

Klaibya is rasapradoshaj also...

We can administer rasapachak dravyas like kiratatikta/ mahasudarshan.

[12/14, 11:31] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 👍🏼👍🏼

[12/14, 12:05] Dr Pankaj Mishra: 

Frequent nocturnal emissions in a married person and unmarried individuals are two different things I think...in unmarried it can be understood easily what might be the reason in married one ??

[12/14, 12:40] Vd Raghuram Bhatta, Banguluru: 

Fantastic views and discussions in *PE* & *ED*👌🙏

*Would like to add*

*Vanga* and *Shilajit*, *Trivanga*... *Chandraprabha* hv given fair results individually or in combo. *Bangsil with Fortege* comes in good...

👉 Whenever I hv tried these for *BPH* and other urinary tract disorders or as additions to Rasayanas, they hv addressed ED and or PE, though many times the patient hasn't revealed these problems while case presentation, but they hv expressed *relief after using them*...so it's good to hv *take one get one free* for patients and *pleasure to bag results* for physicians. It's *win win situation*.

👉 I d add the effect of *Matra Vasti* following Shodhana prakriyas, after assessing dosha predominance and nature of vikriti. Like wise *Uttara Vasti* if it can be done. Choice of medications shall be derived from situational understanding of a given case by the consulting physician.

👉 *Udwarthana with Virechana* in obese patients, *Shirodhara, abhyanga and sarvanga Taila or ksheeradhara* in stress related conditions will work.

👉 The role of *Yoga and dhyana* whenever I hv included, have been found useful.

👉 *Extended foreplay*, *diversion of thoughts and interaction during coitus*, *coitus interruptus*, are helpful...

👉 *Change in positions*, *trying varieties, experimenting and adventures in sexual games....* yes the feel that *sex is an interesting  game having various levels* and determination or *sankalpa to reach the optimum* yields exemplary satisfaction, delays EJ time and *builds confidence* this confido will help in successive attempts to rock the bed...

👉 *Very interesting* is that when things haven't worked out... I hv given *Kutajarishta or kutajaghana Vati* with different combos like  *pushpadhanwa ras or makaradhwaj...*

👉 What ultimately matters is *digging into the cause and addressing it* since these problems hv multiple facets and dimensions...

👉 And many times *we get results out of logics...here Ayurveda wins our wits*

🙏🙏🙏

[12/14, 12:55] Vd V. B. Pandey Basti U. P: 

About Siddha Makardwaj I would like to share my experience that no doubt it's unique rasayan and a fine yogwahi med.but it's main work is on hearts function it stimulation effect may cause tachycardia in patient above age 60.Its my experience only I had never read it in any literature.

[12/14, 13:04] Vd Raghuram Bhatta, Banguluru: 

Would like to add my valued prescription *Vajikara Rasayana +  Chaitanya Rasayana* with or without Shodhana, as per case and convenience of patients, along with other co-prescriptions, lifestyle and dietetic advices.

*Apart from stress, sleeplessness* is one of the causes for ED and PE or loss if interest in sex, shall be addressed. Improved sleep quality has improved performance in many cases. Again, causes of insomnia shall be addressed.

*Subtle emotional conflicts among couple, incompatibility etc* shouldn't be ignored in case taking.... *Councelling and thorough case recording is the key for success* in all diseases...these aren't exceptions.

[12/14, 13:08] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 

Weakness, Gas, Worm may be the cause

[12/14, 14:04] Deepak Bassi Dr: 🙏🏿

[12/14, 14:06] Samta Tomar Dr Jmngr: 👏🏻👏🏻👌🏻

[12/14, 14:07] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh:

 👍🏼👏👏

we can not ignore role of motivational and demotivational group of friends, as described in Charak.🙏🏼

[12/14, 14:08] Dr. Shuchita Arora: 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3202247/

[12/14, 17:56] Anita Gaytri Dr. DG: 

Gokshura too gives good results in ED as gokshura increases blood circulation in the penis.🙏🏼

[12/14, 18:37] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 

Also imcreases Testosterone level.

[12/14, 19:05] Dr Ankur Sharma, Delhi:

If gokshuru  is acting through vasodilation action ,then it should also cause headache ..

As it's  vasodilation can't be limited to penis only.

Anybody notice side effects headache while using gokshuru ???

[12/14, 19:07] Bhushan bhakad Vd. Nasik: 

May be due to gamitv of gokshur is on apan kshetra.

[12/14, 19:07] Vd V. B. Pandey Basti U. P:

 Never any patient has complaint for headache.

[12/14, 19:20] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

1.घृतक्षीराशनो

*2. निर्भी- free from fear*

3. र्निर्व्याधि

*4. र्नित्यगो- habitual to walk daily*

5. युवा ।

सङ्कल्पप्रवणो नित्यं नरः स्त्रीषु वृषायते ॥२०॥

All above 5 points but no. 2 and 4 are most important in present context in young newly married male. Walking or light exercise is most useful by diverting the energy consumption. *Nityago* is very important. I have utilised this concept successfully in almost all kind of patients. Regular Walker or jogger hardly face such kind of PE etc.

Walking+bathing twice morning evening is always add on with any kind of medication.

कृतैककृत्याः सिद्धार्था ये चान्योऽन्यानुवर्तिनः ।

कलासु कुशलास्तुल्याः सत्त्वेन वयसा च ये ॥२१॥

कुलमाहात्म्यदाक्षिण्यशीलशौचसमन्विताः ।

ये कामनित्या ये हृष्टा ये विशोका गतव्यथाः ॥२२॥

ये तुल्यशीला ये भक्ता ये प्रिया ये प्रियंवदाः ।

तैर्नरः सह विस्रब्धः सुवयस्यैर्वृषायते ॥२३॥

अभ्यङ्गोत्सादनस्नानगन्धमाल्यविभूषणैः ।

गृहशय्यासनसुखैर्वासोभिरहतैः प्रियैः ॥२४॥

विहङ्गानां रुतैरिष्टैः स्त्रीणां चाभरणस्वनैः ।

संवाहनैर्वरस्त्रीणामिष्टानां च वृषायते ॥२५॥

These are also very important especially after 40+ when less chance to be in touch with old friends.

🙏🙏

[12/14, 19:21] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

Great discussion !

👌👏🙏🌹

Thanks to all experts. I am sorry I was absent because of some unavoidable circumstances.

🙏🙏🌹🌹

[12/14, 19:23] Dr. Digvijay Singh: 👌🏻👌🏻

[12/14, 19:26] Vd V. B. Pandey Basti U. P: 

Thanks to all for sharing knowledge and experience as well.

[12/14, 19:27] Dr Divyesh Desai: 

Gokshur and Shatavari क्षीरपाक are very useful

No headache with kshir paak...

[12/14, 19:31] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

👌👍🏼👍🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼

gatva snatva paya(milk) peetva rasm vanushyeet , 16 to 70 yrs of age, yatkinchitmadhurm snigdhm jeevanm vringhanm guru, harshanm manahshchev sarvam tt vrishyamuchayte.

[12/14, 19:34] Dr Surendra A Soni:

 यत् किञ्चिन्मधुरं स्निग्धं जीवनं बृंहणं गुरु ।

हर्षणं मनसश्चैव सर्वं तद्वृष्यमुच्यते ॥३६॥

द्रव्यैरेवंविधैस्तस्माद्भावितः प्रमदां व्रजेत् ।

आत्मवेगेन चोदीर्णः स्त्रीगुणैश्च प्रहर्षितः ॥३७॥

गत्वा स्नात्वा पयः पीत्वा रसं वाऽनु शयीत ना ।

तथाऽस्याप्यायते भूयः शुक्रं च बलमेव च ॥३८॥

🙏🌹

[12/14, 19:35] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼

[12/14, 19:36] Dr Surendra A Soni:

👌👍👏

Agni is concerned here it it is not up to the requirements then shunthi, keshar, jayphala may be added as a prakshepa.

Dr. Divyesh Sir !

🙏🌹

[12/14, 19:44] Prof. Uttam Kumar Sharma: 

डॉ सोनी जी यहाँ मेरी समझ में नित्यगो का तात्पर्य पैदल चलने से नहीं है, व्यवाय से है।

[12/14, 19:48] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

हो सकता है सर । गुरुजनों से विनती की इस विषय पर मार्गदर्शन की कृपा करें ।

🙏🙏

[12/14, 19:53] Dr Vinit Arora: 

👍👍 no headache observed while use gokshur in ed patients..

[12/14, 19:53] Dr Vinit Arora: 🙏🙏

[12/14, 19:58] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

आपकी बात चक्रपाणि सम्मत है ।

मुझे हिन्दी टीका याद रही परन्तु चंक्रमण या walking का प्रायोगिक अनुभव उत्तम रहा।

आतुरों ने इसका response उत्कृष्ट बताया है । ये उन लोगों में अधिक सफल रहा जो लोग श्रम नहीं या अत्यल्प करते थे ।

🙏🙏🌹

[12/14, 20:11] Prof. Uttam Kumar Sharma: 

श्लोक संख्या 22 के ...."ये कामनित्या" भी "नित्यगो" के समानार्थक है।

[12/14, 20:18] Dr Divyesh Desai: 

Yes sir, after seeing the Agnibal..👏🏽👏🏽

[12/14, 20:21] Dr. D C Katoch sir: 

Madananand modak inhibits the lower sex centres by acting on higher centres in the cerebral cortex to reduce the propulsive function of epidydmis and seminal vesicles and induce retention of semen.

[12/14, 20:32] Dr. D C Katoch sir: 

Siddha Makardhwaj is nervine rasayana as it modulates autonomic nervous system-sympathetic nerves.

[12/14, 20:33] Prof. Uttam Kumar Sharma: 

Your experience is appreciable and applicable. Vyayam may be included with these activities and walking is a best and most easy and tolerable exercise.

[12/14, 21:22] Anita Gaytri Dr. DG:

No headache has ever been reported by any patient.

[12/14, 21:49] Dr Ankur Sharma, Delhi: 

Then we can assume that there is no vasodilation effects of gokshuru.

[12/14, 21:56] pawan madan Dr: 

Great --- the word SANKALP also need attention here...... I have used this method with success ---

[12/14, 21:59] pawan madan Dr: 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

[12/14, 22:01] pawan madan Dr:

 Dear Ankur ji --- Do you want to say that every vasodilator should cause headache.....?

[12/14, 22:13] Dr Harsh Kishore: 

Dilatation of extracranial blood vessels activates the pain receptors in the surrounding nerves and this created headache... 🙏🙏

[12/14, 22:14] pawan madan Dr:

 only if the extracranial vessels are dilated by that medicine.......my question was different ----

[12/14, 22:15] Dr Ankur Sharma, Delhi: 

How can one say

That gokshuru is selective vadodilator which act on penis only ???

[12/14, 22:15] Bhushan bhakad Vd. Nasik: 

Gokshur itself is such a drug which is used in oligouria and polyuria both situations. So I would suggest better to concentrate on ayurvedik mode of action and physiological correction.

[12/14, 22:17] Dr Ankur Sharma, Delhi: 

Ayurvedic mode of action may be accepted but allopathic ground of vasodilation over penis is not seems appropriate.

[12/14, 22:17] pawan madan Dr:

 right sir ---- but even one considers its vasodilation action.....then also it doesnt cause headache at all......practically observed many many times...

[12/14, 22:17] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

कालो हि *नित्यग* श्चावस्थिकश्च; तत्रावस्थिको विकारमपेक्षते, नित्यगस्तु ऋतुसात्म्यापेक्षः ॥(६)॥

आचार्य उत्तम जी ।

नित्यग से नित्य गमन के कारण 'काल' भी दृष्टव्य है ।

🙏🙏

[12/14, 22:26] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

संकल्पो वृष्याणाम् ।

च सू 25/40

[12/14, 22:28] Dr Surendra A Soni: 👍

[12/14, 22:28] Dr Priy-ranjan Tiwari, Haridwar: 

Mently strong may be sankalp shansay rahit.

[12/14, 22:30] Dr Priy-ranjan Tiwari, Haridwar: 👌

[12/14, 22:30] Vd Raghuram Bhatta, Banguluru: 👌👌👌🙏

[12/14, 22:31] Vd Raghuram Bhatta, Banguluru: 

✅✅✅ absolutely, agree sir...👌👌🙏 *That's what I had pointed in my mornings post*.

[12/14, 22:32] Dr Priy-ranjan Tiwari, Haridwar: 

Sir 👌isi tarah ayurved ki maximum drugs ka pharmacodynamics evum pharmacokinetics nirdharit hona chahiye 🙏

[12/14, 22:32] Dr Priy-ranjan Tiwari, Haridwar: 👌👏🙏

[12/14, 22:33] Dr Priy-ranjan Tiwari, Haridwar: 👌

[12/14, 22:34] Dr Harsh Kishore: 

Sir...  Please explain sankalp in what sence is helpful in vrishya...? 🙏🙏

[12/14, 22:34] Dr Priy-ranjan Tiwari, Haridwar: 👌

[12/14, 22:36] Dr Priy-ranjan Tiwari, Haridwar: 

Ye chesta sankalp evum peedan se sambandhit hai means fearless.

[12/14, 22:38] pawan madan Dr: 

SANKALPA --- 
means to decide what you want to perform and to feel, see, observe, execute that process first in ones mind. Although I can explain this in msg here but this is something like this --- first you think what you want to do -- first this is only superficail thinking --- then you start thinking about this with feelings --- after that only you can manifest it. I hope u will understand the words in between the lines.

[12/14, 22:39] pawan madan Dr: 

cant explain ---

[12/14, 22:40] Dr Harsh Kishore: I got it sir Thanks... 🙏🙏

[12/14, 22:40] Dr Harsh Kishore: Thanks... 🙏🙏

[12/14, 22:41] Vd Raghuram Bhatta, Banguluru: 

✅✅ in simple words, determination and positive visualization... Having control over things and situations and being able to handle them to accuracy.

[12/14, 22:42] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 

I hope u will understand the words in between the lines & eyes & persons.

[12/14, 22:43] pawan madan Dr: 

ab ye nahi samjha mai sir --- he he

[12/14, 22:50] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 

नहीं समझे हे हे it’s always clear that -he he (हे हे is संकल्पहीनता known as झेंप मिटाना .....saying limited words ...like that आज बहुत थका हुवा हूँ .......it is similer to he he or sankalp heenta..

[12/14, 22:54] Dr Priy-ranjan Tiwari, Haridwar: 😊

[12/14, 22:58] Bhushan bhakad Vd. Nasik: 

Sankalp- vrishya

NOT SHUKRAL.

May be Acts via Margasth Ras dhatu

[12/14, 22:59] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

Which is found excessively as a passion in rapist who is predetermined by sexual passion or because of feeling of revenge/hurt etc for female.

My effort to simplify.

Dr. Harsh ji !

🙏🙏

[12/14, 23:00] Dr Jayshri Kulkarni, Latur: 

Being lady practitioner my clinical experience about PE is not countable.

But can't prevent myself from expressing my clear सैद्धांतिक consideration for solving case on strong authentic base....

In Ayurved terminology it is

1. क्षिप्रशुक्रमोक्ष

2.शुक्र अतिवेग

......WSR to वातव्याधि.

Now before treatment

रोगमादौ परीक्षेत ततोनंतरं औषधं ...

 is compulsory to minimise error.

One should decide वातप्रकोप is due to क्षयात् वा मार्गावरोधात्

1)  Use शुक्रवृद्धिकर management in क्षयावस्था

2) Use शुक्रशोधन in मार्गावरोध.

With this firm consideration I have treated few successful cases.

हर्षोSन्नपानं शुक्रस्थे बलशुकक्ररं हितम्।

विबद्धमार्गं दृष्ट्वा वा शुक्रं दद्यात् विरेचनम् ॥

....... Ofcourse चरक!!!!

🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

[12/14, 23:01] pawan madan Dr: ✅

[12/14, 23:02] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

Excellent understanding !!👌👍

🙏🙏

[12/14, 23:21] Prof. Uttam Kumar Sharma: 

रुचि से ही संकल्प में प्रबलता आती है। संकल्प में स्त्री प्रधान कारण है। शायद इसीलिए चरक ने स्त्री को वृष्यतम माना है और अलग अलग रुचि के पुरुष के लिए अलग अलग गुणों युक्त स्त्री को वृष्यतम माना है।

गुरुवर विषय को और स्पष्ट करने की कृपा करें।

[12/14, 23:23] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

👌👍agree

But *harshan* itself is shukravriddhi/srutikar...

👇👇👇

*अपूर्वामिव यां याति नित्यं हर्षातिवेगतः ।*

*गत्वा गत्वाऽपि बहुशो यां तृप्तिं नैव गच्छति ॥१४॥*

*सा स्त्री वृष्यतमा तस्य नानाभावा हि मानवाः ।*

Ch chi 2-1

Dr Bhooshan ji !

[12/14, 23:25] Dr Jayshri Kulkarni, Latur: 

That's (clear understanding)must for वैद्य,

Only

         " सिद्धांत "

Is capable to give reasoning of "success" as well "failure" also

A.....ll treatments discussed about PE in last 3 days on कायसंप्रदाय can be classified into two

क्षय or अवरोध.

So those without appropriate अवस्था have to face failure and vice versa!!🙂🙏🏻

[12/14, 23:27] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

Manovaigyanik paksha ko bhi dhyan me lena hoga jo sabase mahatvapoorn hai....

🙏🙏

[12/14, 23:29] Dr Yogesh Gupta:

 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻 SIR ISME TO SARA MANOVIGYAN SANKALPA PER HI NIRBHAR HAI..

[12/14, 23:30] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 

देह सत्त्वबलापेक्षी हर्ष: शक्तिश्च हर्षजा ४/४५

[12/14, 23:30] Dr Jayshri Kulkarni, Latur: 

🙏🏻 सरजी, चरक ने

पहली चिकित्सा हर्ष

दूसरी अन्नपान कही है..

तो सबसे पहले मनोविज्ञान पे ही ध्यान था उनका तो हमें भी नहीं follow करना है बस।

[12/14, 23:31] Dr Jayshri Kulkarni, Latur: हर्षोSन्नपानं....

[12/14, 23:31] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

Please review 4 vajikaran padas again.

I ve already posted few reference that was hinted by shashi madam.

🙏

[12/14, 23:34] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

👌🙏

Now a days it is most important as previously all honourable members have stressed on it and I am completely agree that each case has its own unique story as well as solutions.

🙏

[12/14, 23:35] Dr Surendra A Soni: 👌🙏🙏🌹

[12/14, 23:44] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 

Every woman is not Vrishytam for every man.

It has specific psychological specification-which are very difficult to to find out now a days . Draupadi of dwapar yug was also not vrishytam for all pandavas in the absence of point 6

१-या परमांगना यस्य हृदयम् आशु प्रविशति ✅

२-समान मन:शया:✅

३-यस्य प्रियै: प्रीयते✅

४-इन्द्रियाणाम् पाशभूता✅

५-ययावियुक्तो अरतिर्मनते✅

६-यस्या ऋते ना शरीरम् न धत्ते❌

७-यां दृष्ट्वा शोकादिभी: न अभिभूयते ✅

अनेक बिन्दु हैं विचारणीय , इनकी उपस्थिति भी विचारणीय,

मुझे नहीं लगता कि वृष्यतम स्त्री संसार में कलियुग में होती होगी क्या ??

[12/14, 23:47] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 

प्रियतमा के न मिलने पर जो लोग आत्महत्या करते है उनमें बिन्दु६ मिलता है वह भी उचित वृष्य स्वरूप में नहीं है शेष ६ अनुपस्थित हैं one way traffic.

[12/14, 23:50] pawan madan Dr: 🙏🙏🙏🙏

[12/15, 07:51] santosh Chavhan dr: 

In PME, त्रिफला भावित जायफल,  commonly used. This formulations Acharya sharangdhar mentioned जातिफल स्तंभक च शोषिणी च हरीतकी।  another technique mentioned by Acharya. 
1.Breathing technique- deep breathing. 
2. Stop start technique. 
3. Frequently changing the position. 4. Diverting focus. 
*Anxiety and high excitement* two main causes in newly married male.                In Case of ED, while taking history, if morning erection is there then there is no organic pathological cause. Purely psychological, but in case of absence of Morning erection,none should rule out- DM, long term use of beta blocker in HT and spinal cord injury....

[12/15, 07:52] pawan madan Dr: ✅✅

[12/15, 07:53] santosh Chavhan dr: 

Not yours... But in general vaidya used to advise like that. But don't forget कोष्ठशोधन.

[12/15, 07:54] pawan madan Dr:

 what do u suggest for KOSHTHA SHODHAN for this purpose Santosh Ji ? --- haritakyaadi yog as we discussed in last 2 days ???

[12/15, 07:55] santosh Chavhan dr: Yes🙏🏻

[12/15, 07:55] pawan madan Dr: ji...thanks...

[12/15, 08:11] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

👍🏼👌👌🙏🏼🙏🏼

Ritu kaal, yugm ayugm, after putereshti yagya etc. are different times ....🙏🏼

[12/15, 08:11] Prof Giriraj Sharma: 👌🏻👌🏻🙏🏻🌹🙏🏻

[12/15, 08:13] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

sankalp-sharsh sankalp, not due to fear or pressure.

Nirvyadhi-jara and shram, aayas r also vyadhis.

[12/15, 08:15] Prof Giriraj Sharma: 

नित्यग

सकंल्प

दोनो  शब्द वृष्य कब लिए प्रयुक्त है परन्तु यहां दो बार उल्लेख हुआ है तो   नित्यग walking के लिए औऱ संकल्प, मैथुन के अभिप्रेत लगता है ।।

[12/15, 08:24] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

👍🏼👌👌👌🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼

ghrit dughdh for vaat 👌, charak has advised rasayan before vrishya, and sanshodhan with haritakyadi yog before rasayan , rasayan is indicated for nirvyadhi persons only.🙏🏼

Nirvyadhi-Sanshodhan with haritakyadi yog- rasayan sewan - vrishya dravya sewan.

as pr Charak.🙏🏼

[12/15, 08:40] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

nityag kaal ke lye apekshit lgta hai sir, walking or exercise in included in nirvyadhi , its my opinion.🙏🏼

[12/15, 08:54] Dr. D C Katoch sir: 

Harshan here means sexual stimulation at psychological level ( i.e. condusive mental status) to indulge in the act.

[12/15, 09:05] Prof Giriraj Sharma: Orgasm.....

[12/15, 09:17] Mayur Surana Dr: 

दौर्मनस्य is अवृष्याणाम् अग्र्य...this way also importance of हर्षण at psychological level be seen...hence सौमनस्यं  गर्भधारणानाम् (prerequisite).

[12/15, 09:27] Prof Giriraj Sharma: 

An emotional & physical excitement during inter-course is orgasm....

स्त्रीपुरुष संयोगे,,,,,,,,,,,,,

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, पटादिव  चरक विमान

[12/15, 09:31] Prof. Deep Narayan Pandey: 

Actually not prerequisite, but it is the leading condition. Because if it is prerequisite then the forced challenges that society presents in the form of crimes against women would not result into pregnancy.

[12/15, 09:33] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

Different factors are as ;

1. Anatomy and physiology of reproductive system.

2.  Neuroanatomy:

    spinal and central   network.

3. Neurotransmitters:

    neurochemicals, Dopamin, serotonin, nitric oxide.

[12/15, 11:46] Prof. Uttam Kumar Sharma: 🙏🙏🌻🌻

[12/15, 11:53] Mayur Surana Dr: 

Food for thought....sightly different...modify/correct...

I think it is prerequisite sir...different concepts in this regard needs to be explored...रज, आर्तव, शुक्र, बीज etc...

Aartava : stree beeja : stree shukra : sarva dhaatu pashchaat : after 1 month. : Sookhma : micro even today : Apratyaksha in those days

Shukra : purusha beeja : sarva dhaatu pashchaat : after 1 month : Sookhma : micro even today : Apratyaksha in those days

Stree : Raja : RasaJanya upadhaatu : beeja maadhyama / medium : sthoola : pratyaksha

Purusha : ? : RasaJanya upadhaatu : beeja maadhyama / medium : sthoola : pratyaksha...

Klaibya is Rasjanya, atichintan is Rasdushtihetu...

So saumansya primarily helps is proper formation of medium for Stree beej --artav and purush beej--shukra....

So even in criminal cases, these entities are previously formed if prior saumanasya is there...

Sankalpa and harshan (words used in cha chi 15) help in propelling this medium (semen perse, not shukra-beej, shukra beej may or may not be there---if it is, then after entering yoni, by vyaan vayu it is taken internally in stree sharir--अ.सं) at the time of sexual act, that too specifically in males; in females also ( but here स्त्रीणां शुक्रं न भवेद् गर्भाय, भवेद् गर्भाय चार्तवम्).

...so basically what we call as semen is Rasjanya, it carries shukrabeej...

रस and हर्ष both are प्रीणनानाम्....हर्ष is common भाव in Rasa and Shukra

So in the context, Rasa, Aartav, Beej, Shukra, updhatu etc. terms must be explicitly defined....

[12/15, 12:02] Dr. Sharad Trivedi, Shimala: 

उत्तम जी एक प्रश्न था, आयुर्वेद में नक्र शुक्र का प्रयोग शुक्राल्पता में बताया गया हैं , तो रस से रक्त धातु निर्माण , इसी प्रकार सभी धातु निर्माण खले कपोत न्याय  आदि जो आयुर्वेद में वर्णित हैं , तो क्या शुक्र सेवन से शुक्र वृद्धि होगी ?

[12/15, 12:14] Bhushan bhakad Vd. Nasik: 

Right 👍🏻

but at about shukra dushti janya klaibya??

[12/15, 12:21] Mayur Surana Dr: 

It can be beejbhoot vikruti../Genetic... more severe form...asadhya...if it is really beejbhoot....

We should question ourselves ,whether we really treat Rasaj klaibya or Shukraj klaibya...on a very subtle note,I am telling🙏🏼

[12/15, 12:37] Mayur Surana Dr: 

On a lighter note...
historically...Satyavati/Kali/Matsyagandha was born from swallowing the ejaculate...so was Makardhwaj (son of Hanuman)😅...Dutch research suggests engulfing semen to reduce preeclampsia and even aiding fertility by making female more immune to sperm antibodies..again these are very coarse studies...Not foolproof either...Pertaining more to subtle forms of Rasaj shukra than Shukra perse...{vaidya Phansalkar, a renowned vaidya used to say--each dhatu is made of 6 other dhatus---Hence mandala aushadhi sevan means 7 * 7=49 or 7*6=42 (considering shukra vikarasa are asadhya in this tantra)} However samanya siddhant should /can be viewed in this light....

Lighter note*

[12/15, 13:34] Satish Sharma ji Dr: dravya samanyat..
.

[12/15, 15:27] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

sir all these factors are not for just conception, but for healthy progeny.  Otherwise there are so many exceptions, daiv , unknown factors can also work. Example of IUI, IVF etc are also there.🙏🏼

[12/15, 15:33] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

vrishya aushadh are advised for next 100s of generations, ie grand grand  chidren of persons will be having best dhatus in them, best genetic material will be there for generations.

[12/15, 15:34] Dr Shashi Jindal, Chandigarh: 

as described by Charak.🙏🏼

[12/15, 16:36] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

👌👌👏👍

Most important practical approach Santosh Sir.

🙏🌹

[12/15, 16:41] Dr Surendra A Soni: 👍

[12/15, 19:25] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 

अगर शेष भाव सामान्य हों तो *प्रगाढ़ प्रेम* व्यक्ति को वृषयतम स्त्री/पुरुष बना सकता है।

My small understanding of human psychology 🙏🏻

[12/15, 19:26] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 👌🏻👍🏻

[12/15, 19:27] Dr Pravin Soni Beawar: 

Rite sir ..a pt came to me some time before said this.he is fit with his gf bt have e.d with his wife.

[12/15, 19:30] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 👍🏻👍🏻

[12/15, 19:34] Dr. D C Katoch sir: 

नित्यग का सीधा मतलब (शुक्र के) नित्य गिरने से है।

[12/15, 20:11] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

I frequently use B. Bageshwar ras in patients PE with mridu koshtha, frequent diarrheal tendency, IBS or chronic dysentery, sense of fear or psychological fear that lead to increase in motion frequency. It genuinely improves absorption and give real strength to the body without any kind of vyavayi, vikasi effects. It is drug of choice in sukumar, mridu koshthi people as per my understanding. Jayaphal 1 to 2 gms+milk is recommended anupan where increase in  duration is desired

🙏🙏

[12/15, 20:26] Dr. D C Katoch sir: 

Bangeshwar Ras is a soft medicine for chronic  सर लक्षणयुक्त व्याधि provided manufactured properly.

[12/15, 20:29] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

सर लक्षण युक्त व्याधि ?

सरण युक्त व्याधि जैसे अतिसार आदि या कुछ और ?

सर !

Please guide...

🙏🙏

[12/15, 20:34] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

👌👌👏👏👍👍🙏

Very Well summarised including all essential aspects Raghu Sir !

Cause is most important.

🙏🙏🌹

[12/15, 20:37] Dr Surendra A Soni: 

Rightly observed Sir !

It may cause heart burn if proper sahpan, anupan is not given.

🙏🙏

[12/15, 21:09] pawan madan Dr: 👌👌👌

[12/16, 08:50] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 

यहाँ पृश्न वृष्यतम का है , इसमें चरकोक्त सम्पूर्ण परिस्थितियाँ यथातथ रूप में ही अपेक्षित है अन्यथा वृष्यतमत्व नहीं होगा , वृष्य या वृष्यतर होकर रह जायेगा l

[12/16, 09:20] Dr Bhadresh Nayak, Surat: 

But sometimes it's created psychological disorder due to
Fear
Anxiety
Guilty feeling
It's adverse effects on mind.
Dr Shekhar !

[12/16, 09:31] Dr Shekhar Singh Rathoud: 

वृष्यतमा स्त्री का जो स्वरूप संहिता में वर्णित है वो केवल राजाओ को ही लभ्य है। सामान्य व्यक्ति के लिए एक लक्षण " जिसके साथ रमण से कभी मन न भरे", इस संदर्भ में कहा।। 🙏🏻

[12/16, 17:30] Prof. Ramakant Chulet Sir: 


और यही एक लक्षण उसे सर्वलक्षण सम्पूर्ण बना देता है . वयो। रूप वचो हावै: या यस्य परमांगना ।प्रविशति आशु हृदयम् 
यही है सम्पूर्णत्व, यदि पुरूष ने इस हृदय प्रवेश को अंगीकार कर लिया या पूरुष द्वारा अंगीकार होने के पश्चात् पुरुष हृदय में स्त्री प्रवेश हुवा तो “गत्वा गत्वापि बहुश: यां तृप्तिम् नैव अधिगत्छति लक्षण पुरुष में ही अभिव्यक्त होता है । जब तक यह स्थितियाँ स्त्री पुरुष में दोनों में है स्त्री वृष्यतम ही  है उस पुरुष के लिये, यदि वह नित्यगमन के सामर्थ्य को बनाये रखता है, नित्यगमन करते  हुये, सब ठीक है । घृतदुग्धादि मधुरस्निग्ध आहार न लेते हुये, नित्यगमन करें तो वृष्यतम स्त्री प्रतिलोम शुक्रक्षय हेतु में परिवर्तित हो जायेगा — स्वार्थी पुरुष कहेगा - मैं इसके चक्कर में मारा गया ....
शास्त्र कहता है .. प्राज्ञ: प्रागेव तत्कुर्यात् हितम् विद्यात् यद् आत्मन:।
पुरुष भी प्रयत्न करे कि वो भी वृष्यतम हो स्त्री  के लिये ...

और इन परिस्थितियों के लिये राजा होना आवश्यक नहीं है .....






**************************************************************************

Above discussion held on 'Kaysampraday" a Famous WhatsApp-discussion-group  of  well known Vaidyas from all over the India. 

Compiled & edited by

Dr.Surendra A. Soni

M.D.,PhD (KC)

Associate Professor

DEPT. OF KAYACHIKITSA

Govt. Ayurveda College

Vadodara GUJARAT, India.

Email: surendraasoni@gmail.com

Mobile No. +91 9408441150